Cash Flow Is Oxygen: Sales Lessons Every Early-Stage Founder Needs with Katie Nelson

If you’re posting, branding, and “working on your website” but not actually closing clients, this episode is your wake-up call. 

Sales strategist Katie Nelson (The Sales Catalyst and CEO of Sales Uprising) breaks down why so many first-time founders drown in marketing while starving their business of cash. 

If you’ve ever avoided sales because you’re introverted, uncertain, or afraid of hearing “no,” this conversation will change how you think about selling forever.

📌What’s covered:

• How to stop hiding behind “busy marketing work” and finally face the sales conversations your business is starving for.
• Why quiet, thoughtful founders can actually crush it in sales, and how to turn your introversion into a superpower.
• The hard truth about why your beautiful website and content aren’t converting, and what has to change before clients start saying yes.
• How to break free from living off random referrals and build a sales pipeline that feels steady, intentional, and in your control.
• How to turn the sting of “no” into data, confidence, and momentum instead of doubt, shame, and hiding from selling.

Katie Nelson, Founder and CEO of Sales UpRising, has built her business around this message: Cashflow Is Oxygen. She is committed to bringing the fun back into sales and helping her clients grow their small businesses into six-figure-plus Big League Players. Katie is a speaker, consultant, and business coach with a total 25 years of sales expertise and $150 million sold in products and services. 

🌐 Learn more about Katie https://salesuprising.com/

🤝Connect with Katie https://www.instagram.com/salesuprising

🚀The Founder’s Voice Quiz is the foundation for a client attraction system that works with your strengths, not against them. 

💛Share with a friend who would enjoy this conversation.

Thank you for listening in! See you next week.

Transcript

[00:00:00] The small business success statistics suck, and by that I mean not even half of the businesses that start in any given year will make it to their third year or their fifth year. Statistically speaking, marketing is a place where you can drown. That's such a place that I can dig into and feel. Extremely productive while procrastinating.

The one thing that keeps my business alive, which is selling your clients have all the answers that you want. They have everything behind every client is you getting to know more about you, your business, what you wanna put forward, how you're going to do your delivery, and what they really want. There's only one thing that a business eats, and that's cash.

So cashflow is oxygen. As soon as you take your eye off of the incoming cash concept, your business starts to suffocate. Give yourself [00:01:00] more grace and just decided to do it imperfectly until you get it right.

Priscilla: Welcome to the Entrepreneur's Kitchen. Today I've got a very special guest for you. Katie Nelson, and she is the CEO of sales uprising. Katie is known as the sales catalyst. So if you're having problems with your sales, if you're thinking about your sales all the time, peek your ears 'cause you want to listen in on this conversation.

Katie, I'm so happy to have you here because. Entrepreneurs, like how do we turn this content into conversations, into sales and to clients.

Katie Nelson: Thank you so much for having me, Priscilla. Uh, the Entrepreneur's Kitchen is something that I can absolutely get behind. It seems to me like a place where really good stuff is cooked up. So it's a kitchen I wanna be in. As far [00:02:00] as my mission, you know, from a legacy place. Here in the States, and I don't know about around the world, I keep threatening to look it up.

The small business success statistics suck, and by that I mean not even half of the businesses that start in any given year will make it to their third year or their fifth year, statistically speaking. So if the work that I do could change those statistics. To the positive by 1%. I would be thrilled, especially when you consider that there are 24 million small businesses in the United States at this moment, and that's not even around the world.

So that's my mission.

Priscilla: Wow , thank you so much for the work that you do. I wondered for you, Katie, were you a natural salesperson when you started on this entrepreneurial journey?

Katie Nelson: I think that, that's a great question. If you can define for me your idea of a natural salesperson.

Priscilla: You know, people [00:03:00] picture outgoing, , naturally persuasive, all the things that people think, well, I'm not that. I'm wondering, was this something that came to you naturally

Katie Nelson: so from a very young age, I think I decided that I was going to be in sales, but probably not because I had an aptitude for it, but because it was a job you could get as a teenager. Working , in a call center was a job you could get, and there was a call center right across the street from my high school and because I wanted to work right, I was one of three kids in the eighties.

, If I wanted to go to a movie, I wanted to have my own movie money so I didn't have to ask my parents for it. I think that that's how I fell into it. I don't even think I looked for jobs. I was like, oh, I know they take kids, so I'll go work there. And the bigger story both my parents were entrepreneurs.

My bonus mom, Sally was the CFO of her family company. And my dad owned his own machine shop and I grew up. Listening to business conversation [00:04:00] and I kind of always thought, oh my gosh. Like maybe if they had a really good salesperson, they wouldn't have any worries in the world. 'cause there'd be enough money for everything.

So in the simplest way a kid can make a connection. I think that's kind of what I thought do, I think I have the natural skills it takes to be a salesperson. The answer to that is that you really just have to like humanity and I do. I like humanity, so I'm authentically curious about everything.

, Some people could call me nosy, like when I was a kid. 'cause I would ask all the questions all the time, well, why is that? And why is that? And why is this over here? And tell me more. And, you know, how do these things go together? How could they go together differently? I'm sure my parents were like, oh my gosh, please go sit in a corner and read a book.

So I would go do that too. And what I tell my clients, the ones who feel like maybe they don't come to their business with that particular skillset, like this authentic curiosity or the strength to engage in a conversation. [00:05:00] I tell them that introverts sell better than extroverts because statistically speaking, that's true.

So yes, I have a wildly outgoing personality, Priscilla, and ultimately it gets in my way as a salesperson because I like to talk. And when you're doing a good sales job, you're not talking so much as you're listening.

Priscilla: now you've flipped that on us. 'cause now I'm like, okay, introverts do a better job than extroverts. You gotta unpack that and being, outgoing and bubbly, and talkative is actually working against you. Why? Tell us more, Katie.

Katie Nelson: so people have an assumption that salespeople are great talkers and they have the assumption that what they're gonna get is a whole bunch of information that they don't want. So knowing that I'm naturally outgoing and that I'm talkative because people can hear me from across a room as an example.

They think, oh, she's gonna try and sell me something. Nothing will kill a deal faster than, oh, she's gonna try and sell me something. Introverts don't walk into a sales conversation the same way as an [00:06:00] extrovert does. And because they are quieter. Because let's be clear, the difference between introverts and extroverts is where you get your energy, right?

And introverts get their energy when they have the ability to be their most creative selves in a quieter space, whereas I find my energy. Talking to the garbage man, I can talk to anybody, but sales at its heart isn't about that. It is about connecting. But introverts have the ability to connect just as much as extroverts.

Just because you're an introvert, doesn't mean that you also hold the quality of shy. My best friends on this earth are introverts, and when you get them going on a topic that they know and have passion about. They could run you over just like I can because they're so strong in their conviction about a particular topic.

So they're not shy people, they're just introverted. So introverts have an almost innate way of diverting [00:07:00]conversation from themselves to draw in clients so that clients will be talking, or prospects, which is ultimately what you want in an effort to be able to convert to a client.

Priscilla: So good. Why do you think that many first time founders avoid selling? I know everyone is in this online, behind the computer world.

Katie Nelson: maybe you came into your business and you didn't have the skillset of selling, and just like every to-do list. In every home for every person, everywhere. The things we don't wanna do or don't know how to do or are nervous about doing automatically fall to the bottom of the to-do list.

So what rises to the top are the things we might be more interested in? The things we wanna learn about, say marketing. It's easier for me to think, how do I put myself forward online in a logo or in a color. So I take classes from experts about marketing. That's such a place that I can dig into and feel extremely productive [00:08:00] while procrastinating.

The one thing that keeps my business alive, which is selling.

Priscilla: I love that you just let us there because now you know, people think, okay, we got a marketing problem, or maybe we have a selling problem. Okay. What's the distinction?

Katie Nelson: So at the end of the day, marketing absolutely has a place if you are a first time founder, right? So my specialty is in the startup phase of business. So for service-based business owners that are looking to get to their first quarter of a million dollars. Or really clearly their first six figures.

Marketing is a place where you can drown. You have all this bootstrap money, right? You have all this money that you either saved or that you've decided you're going to spend one of the two. Not all of us are intentional entrepreneurs. Some of us are accidental entrepreneurs. We're taking advantage of an opportunity that our life provided, so I maybe didn't save to start a business.

Maybe I just said, okay, I can make it [00:09:00] work. So you've got two handfuls of cash and by the time you look up after you've developed your website and you've learned all of the classes about social media, one, you're out of Bootstrap Cash. So now there's no more money to put in the business. It's the fastest way to kill your business because here's the God's honest truth.

Your business marketing will really be hot, sexy stuff once you actually have a couple clients. Why do you think that is Priscilla,

Priscilla: You know what they want. You now know , it's not an assumption anymore.

Katie Nelson: Your clients have all the answers that you want. They have everything behind every client is you getting to know more about you, your business, what you wanna put forward, how you're going to do your delivery, and what they really want. So you're, marketing in the beginning pitch t like throw up a lead page, have your name be on it. I think I had a website that said sales uprising in like this. I [00:10:00] started this business nine years ago, so work with me. It had this like ombre color. I mean, it was hideous. It was horrible. It was awful because I am not a marketing guru.

I am a sales guru, so I was like, all I need is for me to be real on the internet. I think it literally said sales uprising, business coach. Call Katie at this number. I may or may not even have had an email address on it, and it was for five years, and I just let it sit there. Because my clients weren't on the other end of a website.

My ideal client, is not scrolling to find their next business coach. They'll be introduced to them by someone. They'll have seen me somewhere. They'll have heard me speak. So then they're like, oh, here's a phone number. Oh, why do I have a phone number? Oh, that's amazing.

Maybe I should just text her. So, you know, you'd get texts or whatever. Some people would call you. , For three years, I didn't look into it. I got clients instead.

Priscilla: . Now to the person who's listening, who's like, oh gosh, Katie, , that's what I've been doing. Okay, well, what should I do now?

Katie Nelson: Wonderful. So for three years you [00:11:00] didn't have a website and now your business is up and running, maybe you're making your first six figures. Right? Fantastic. You've done your budget right. You know what you can afford. You have your paycheck set. The business isn't an expensive hobby anymore.

Your life and the business life gets to separate a little bit. Now that you've done all of this really heavy uplift on the startup work, good job. Congratulations. Now you create a budget for what it's gonna look like to create a machine. So that it doesn't just have to be you. This is where your marketing comes into play.

And the beautiful part is you have X amount of clients where you can go and be like, so can I take you out to a drink, coffee, tea cocktail? And you let me know exactly why I was your pick, please. 'cause I'm about to write my marketing and oh my gosh, you've done a great job for them.

They would love that. Especially if you pick up the tab, right? So they're happy to talk about it. You've done a great job for them. Go ask them. Get your testimonials right from the very beginning. Get your testimonials. Don't do [00:12:00]marketing, but you better scoop up those. Oh, I love him. I love her. I would work with them, right?

Scoop them up. Scoop them up, scoop them up, and then when you finally get your marketing ready to go. Think about it. You guys, I can't tell you how many people I've given this advice to and they do it anyway. Nope, Katie, I'm already started. I've already got half my website built, so I'm just gonna keep going.

Six months later, they come to me and say, I get it now. And the one difference is that now they have clients. , They didn't get their clients through their website, but they now have clients and they can see how that marketing reads differently because their clients gave them the answers. They can see themselves through the eyes of their ideal client profile.

Here's the other thing about that. How many of you started your business and knew who your ideal client profile, target, market, or niche? Lots of ways to say it. How many of you knew who that was? It's okay. You can say none, right? Because it's still [00:13:00] just our idea. It's our idea of who that is until it's a buyer. , The people you do business with, the people I did business with in my first year of business aren't the people that I do business with. Now, nine years later, your target market is almost ever evolving. Because you as the CEO founder, president of your business are ever evolving, right?

I'm sure there are people who listen to the Entrepreneur's Kitchen and they're like, oh my gosh, Katie, you're so right. I got it so wrong in the beginning

Priscilla: so true. 'cause I remember, , you have this idea of like, well, who do I wanna work with? Oh, I'd really love to work with them. And then you realize, no, actually you do not love working with them, and they are not the client that you're after.

And that was not enjoyable. It might have been the person you thought, oh, I could kind of be friends with them. I can picture working with them, but no, maybe that's not your ideal client. So I get how this sort of evolves over time. As you work with people, you get a sense of them, you get a sense of yourself, a sense of what is more profitable, [00:14:00] of where are you best positioned, all those kind of things come into play.

Uh, Katie, you've built your business around the phrase cash flow is oxygen. I wonder what made you land on that message?

Katie Nelson: So sales Uprising is the third business I've owned. I've owned two previous businesses in professional services and staffing, and the last one of those businesses I grew to a $6 million run rate in under three years. And the. Only thing that if there's one thing I've learned in over a decade of being a business owner is that at the end of the day, regardless of me, the one who created and birthed it all, there's only one thing that a business eats and that's cash.

So when we're talking about, the human side of it, we need to make sure our oxygen mask is on first. There's no job harder than being an entrepreneur and nobody. Quite gets it until they have to do it. Like you're having a bad day. You can even yell at your kid, [00:15:00] right? Johnny, quit bothering me, Julie, hold still.

Like you can have a little bit of that with your kid 'cause then you can apologize and of course they love you and it can turn into a learning moment. Try having that learning moment with a client that you charge amazing rates to. They pay you to be at your best all the time. For them very specifically, let's not forget that.

So my business doesn't care about the mood that I'm in, whether or not I have a cold, if I'm feeling like I'm gonna kill it, or if I'm feeling like I'm, the slime off the top of a lake, my business does not care. My business is looking to see whether or not I've got dollars coming in so that it can stay alive and it will never be different.

You grow in staff, they want your money. You grow in marketing. It wants your money. Business in and of itself as an institution is not personal. What makes it personal is those of us who choose to do it. So cashflow is oxygen. [00:16:00]Your business will quit. breathing . It will be suffocating every time you're too scared to make a deal.

You don't focus on bringing in clients. It's not the big rock of your business. As soon as you take your eye off of the incoming cash concept, your business starts to suffocate. That's why I say cash flow is oxygen.

Priscilla: So well said. Sometimes people in the early stages, tinker around, until the runway is gone and like you said, we avoid doing the thing we know we should do. And I wonder, maybe. Daily practices, maybe a mindset reframe, you know, better in this world of like, you're that person who's tinkering, who knows you shouldn't be tinkering.

Who knows, Hey, this business needs cash. How do you switch your mind or switch your habits to match the fact that you know that cash is the priority?

Katie Nelson: I don't know that I would say that I'm the habits expert. I would say about that is how I choose to do that is jump in head first. So I'm very much like [00:17:00] a buffalo, right? The buffalo goes towards the storm so that the storm can go over them faster. I'm very much that. I'm like, okay, here's this storm and maybe it's an S storm.

I don't know if we curse on this podcast, so I won't say it, but. It's this really bad, ugly storm. I've got bills coming in the door. , It's starting to feel lots and lots of pressure. Well, all right, let's do the thing you don't wanna do, because what I can guarantee you is if you focus on sales, you will get exponentially better daily , if you are spending four hours of your time per day for a week.

And being wildly present to the conversations that you're having, what you're hearing, you're actively listening, right? You're not listening to be able to speak. You heard from Katie Nelson that your potential clients have all the answers for you, so you wanna listen to them within an inch of your life.

You wanna know what they're saying, you wanna know how they say it. So you can identify whether or not they have the problem you think they have, the one that you [00:18:00] solve. If you do that four hours a day. Call after call. By the end of that week, the amount of data alone that you will have about how those people see you, how they see your business, and whether or not they wanna move forward with you in a business relationship, it will pay it forward to your business exponentially.

Additionally, you will have gotten over yourself. You will realize hearing this stuff does not kill you. It doesn't. You guys. Outside of owning a business, you've lived a whole life already. You came to your business. Having lived a whole life that I happen to know was not filled only with yeses. The guarantee is that you became a business owner.

Having heard the word no before, you're not that precious, like you will survive it. It's okay. It makes you hungrier to some extent. Well, so no, you don't wanna do business with me. Can I ask you why? You and I just had this amazing [00:19:00] exchange about how what I do is solve the problem you have. So can you tell me where the disconnect is for you? What, how amazing would that be for your business if you just went a little bit further and asked why? No.

Priscilla: You know Katie, so many times you speak to someone and they start selling you before they even know if you need the thing, and then you've got to say, oh, actually I don't live in that kind of house that needs that kind of thing, but. You never gave me a chance to tell you that I don't need that thing.

And, I don't know if it's maybe fear where you just rush and to tell the person , what they need or maybe not knowing. So I'm thinking maybe you can tell us one key to getting the sale right. Early. Just one key. 

Katie Nelson: Just one. Priscilla, you're mean? 

Priscilla: Give

Katie Nelson: I would say. Okay. What I would say is, do you know what is important to you and your business? Is money the most important thing for your business? Yes, because it, it needs to breathe, [00:20:00] but bots don't buy. Humans buy. So at the end of the day, you actually really need to be very interested in the human.

So you see somewhat at a networking event and you wanna sell them something for their house instead of selling them something . Why don't you ask them what kind of house they have? So what you just said goes very much into what we spoke of a little bit earlier. It has more to do with listening than it has to do with talking. People buy from people they know like, and trust. I'm not gonna get to know you until I get to have a conversation with you. Listen to what I said until I get to have a conversation with you. A conversation is a two-way street. That means it's not just about me. In sales. It's never just about me, so it's always about the connection you make with another person. So if there was one thing I would say, put you on the back burner. You already know about you. If you ever feel like, oh, I've gotta go sell this person, I want you to [00:21:00] take a deep breath and a step back. I was on a podcast earlier this week and a guy said something that is just so hideous to me.

He said, you can smell commission breath a mile away. Now you have to understand at one point in time, I was a commission only salesperson. It's this like. Ever met anybody who had bad breath. It's like that commissioned breath is like that. I need your money. And you're like, oh my God, you ha, you're so just move away.

Move away. So you don't need to have that. You already know who you are. You know the expertise that you created an entire business on. Yes. If this is your first deal, maybe you're having what they call imposter syndrome. And I would tell you, you're not gonna know until you deliver something to somebody.

So get to it. Get to it and get over that.

Priscilla: Like you said, not knowing the world. Being sort of afraid of what you don't know thinking maybe you can think your way out of things or find another way to get around it, there must be another way. , you teach founders how to cross the six figure [00:22:00] line.

For the person that maybe your business is stuck either in inconsistent sales or there's no growth in your sales, what do you advise that person, if that's your client, do.

Katie Nelson: First and foremost, what you need to focus on is your target market. There's a reason why you might be stuck in six figures. , When you first got into business, how you got clients was because your friends knew that you were doing it. Maybe they introduced you to a couple people. You got to have a couple deals under your belt, and then you stopped. Whether it was because you ran out of friends, who had people to introduce you to or whatever it was, you then looked around and said, well, so where'd all those people go? That was just the beginning. So think about the data that you got in your business when you made those couple of deals. Which part of those ideal clients would you keep?

Which part was absolutely wrong? And then go research those rooms where those people hang out. Your newly dusted off, newly created niche or target. Go find those people. Immerse [00:23:00] yourself in them. If you run a business that has a big industry so if you're financial services experts, I love that you go to financial services, conventions and conferences, but those people aren't your target market.

That's you learning stuff. You probably already know. I need you to get to where the people that need you are. Not in the rooms of people that are gonna be like, oh my gosh, you're an amazing financial services person. Again, it's a great ego boost, but it doesn't feed your business. So focus on your target market.

Truly identify whether or not what you deliver and the price that you deliver it at is appropriate for the people that you're trying to sell it to.

Priscilla: Yeah. , That phase where referrals are just working, your network is just working, and you think that's gonna work forever. You've got the initial information that you needed, the hard information. Let me make some decisions.

Let me see where I wanna go and then let me get to know this. A customer that I now have identified that this is my [00:24:00] customer. Yeah. Uh, thanks for that, Katie. That'll help a lot of people.

Katie Nelson: I hope so. Because the Venn diagram is who are you as a business owner and what does your company wanna put forward? There's this group of people that you think you wanna work with. Here's this money that they can provide. And once you put all of these circles together, in the middle of that is your target market.

You don't forget, you guys, your money is the bullseye of the dart board aren't they called darts in Australia? They're

Priscilla: Yes. Yes.

Katie Nelson: , the bullseye is the tiniest. Place on the dartboard. Not all of the people in the room where your potential clients are, are actually your clients.

Just a handful of them. You don't need all of them. You just need a couple of them, the right ones, because I can tell you the wrong ones are so much more work and effort, right? And that's not what you're looking for. Identify your target and go after them. Speak how they speak. Have the hobbies that they have, like [00:25:00] know them because then not only are you the expert in your financial services or whatever it is that you're looking to sell, but you're the expert in them.

Who doesn't wanna buy from that?

Priscilla: It's interesting 'cause even when you think about just the way that people group one another, the moment you meet someone who likes what you like . Automatically you just hit it off. 

So if you know your target market that's a huge opportunity there.

Katie, if you could share the most important lessons you've learned in sales. And maybe how you learn them, that would be interesting.

Katie Nelson: Golly, I, what a delightful question. No, nobody's ever asked me it, so here's what I'm gonna say. What I've learned about sales is Murphy's Law of Sales, assumption will kill all deals. The exact moment that you think you're hot , that you know your ideal client profile and you don't need them to talk anymore because you have them, you got this for them.

The things that you assume will be the exact places that your deal will die,

you assume their budget. No deal. You [00:26:00] assume that they have the problem to the same level that you think they have the problem. No deal. You assume that because you know them, they know you, you like them, so they like you. No dice and it happens so often and when was the last time I learned it?

I don't know, frequently, once every six months, in sales you start to get ahead of your skis, I think is the saying, right? , You build momentum, you build momentum, and things are just popping and popping and popping. And so maybe you start forgetting a couple of questions, Heather, feather and yawn and always.

It will be that first conversation that I have where I've not asked all of my qualifying questions or re-qualifying questions, it will be that, and I'll be like, look at what you did, Kathleen, in that voice. you talk to yourself like your mother did when you were a kid, right?

Look at what you did. You made a mess. You made a mess of it. Because the truth of the matter is, is that that person was probably a good client for me, and I'm the one who messed it up. So I have to make the decision, am I gonna start all over again with the relationship and do it the right way? Or do I just [00:27:00] let that poor business owner float off into a sea of, oh my gosh, I can literally tell you that in six months they're not gonna have enough money to have their business go forward.

Priscilla: There you go. To the audience that's listening. Katie, just to finish this off, I'm just gonna ask you, let's see, five quick questions just kinda like a rapid round. Okay. , Katie, the biggest sales lie you once believed I.

Katie Nelson: That you will always be at the top of your game. Once you get there, you'll always be there

Priscilla: The first step to creating a sales pipeline,

Katie Nelson: knowing who your target market is.

Priscilla: One sentence that prospects open up to.

Katie Nelson: Tell me about your day

Priscilla: Your favorite objection.

Katie Nelson: Time. I don't have any time.

Priscilla: The metric that you watch like a hawk.

Katie Nelson: My client's outcomes.

Priscilla: Thank you so much, Katie. Please to the audience Katie's the CEO of sales uprising. Katie, are you online or where can people get to know more about you?

Katie Nelson: I now have a website, Priscilla, so you can go to www dot. Sales uprising.com. You'll now [00:28:00] even get to see a picture of me. So there's a way to contact me through that. But if you prefer to go on LinkedIn, I'm Katie Nelson, sales Catalyst. You can join my newsletter, watch where I'm traveling, watch what I'm offering.

Keep in touch. You can just book a calendar. I love to talk to people. And I love to listen. Get on my calendar, go to YouTube, look up all my funny little YouTube stuff. Now, I'm everywhere, Priscilla. Oh, I'm not on X and I'm not on Discord is probably easier to say where I'm not.

But yeah, so LinkedIn, Facebook for both the sales uprising.com and for me personally at Katie Nelson.

Priscilla: thank you so much to the audience that's listening. I think this conversation has been great. The heart of it. You've gotta love people, you've gotta love humanity, and I love the perspective that you've brought to sales. Just get it done. Just get it done, and you'll get better as you go. Katie's the last thing you'd like to say to our audience.

Katie Nelson: I love that. Let's go with that. Quit giving yourself such a hard time. [00:29:00] You've set such a high bar for yourself that you think you need to knock it out. The part your first go at it. Assume that's a lie, because it is. You don't, you can only get better, and that's what you wanna do. Imagine a business that you were great at right out the gate.

How bored do you think you'd be six months later? Give yourself more grace and just decide to do it imperfectly until you get it right.

Priscilla: You know when you said that I thought of good as the enemy of great. So if you're starting out and you're not good, that's awesome. You get an opportunity to be great. Put in the reps. Thank you so much, Katie.

Katie Nelson: Have a great day, Priscilla. Thank you so much for having me.